160: Career Development 101 for Graduate Students with Dr. Emmanuela Stanislaus

Dra. Yvette Martinez-Vu

Welcome back everyone to the Grad School Femtoring podcast. This is your host Dra. Yvette. Today I have a career development episode with our guest, Dr. Emmanuela Stanislaus.

Dra. Yvette Martinez-Vu

Dr. Emmanuela is a multi-passionate professional who serves as a diversity researcher and consultant, doctorate coach, scholar, and podcast host of the Writing On My Mind podcast, through her consulting company, Dr. Emmanuela Consulting. As a doctorate coach, she's on a mission to help women of color doctoral students get unstuck and reclaim the power they have over their doctoral journey. As a consultant, she uses the skills she's gained in her day job leading university career centers, to help organizations identify and strategically implement anti- racist processes to recruit and retain diverse talent. Ah, that's so great. Welcome to the podcast, Dr. Emmanuela.

Dr. Emmanuela Stanislaus

Thank you so much, Dr. Yvette. I appreciate you having me.

Dra. Yvette Martinez-Vu

Of course.

Dr. Emmanuela Stanislaus

I'm excited to chat about career development.

Dra. Yvette Martinez-Vu

Me too. I think that this topic is much, much needed. I'd love for you to start us off by sharing a little bit more about yourself, about who you are and what you do. And hopefully also a little bit more about your background and backstory.

Dr. Emmanuela Stanislaus

Yeah, definitely. I know the intro that you provided says a lot. But I just want to add a little bit of dimension, because we're more than just our bio.

Dra. Yvette Martinez-Vu

Yes.

Dr. Emmanuela Stanislaus

But as you shared on Emmanuela. I go by Dr. Emmanuela a lot on social, just because my last name is just so difficult- even though my first name is really wrong. But...

Dra. Yvette Martinez-Vu

I'm so self-conscious that I might be saying it wrong, because of my Spanish pronunciation.

Dr. Emmanuela Stanislaus

No, you never say it wrong. I love the Spanish way of saying my name. It's just sounds like music, so don't feel bad at all. I don't say it that way, because I can't roll all of my M's and L's the way you do. But you know, I pronounce it Emmanuela. And an important piece of my story is that I'm the child of Samuel and Rose-Marie, who were immigrants to this country.

Dr. Emmanuela Stanislaus

They migrated from Haiti to Brooklyn, New York, which is where I was born. And they came to this country, both at the age of twenty-nine with just themselves. They had me a year after their journey to the country. Like I said, I'm a child of immigrants. And I am what is considered second generation American. A lot of folks will say first generation. But kind of tied to my dissertation topic, I studied the experiences of second generation, Afro- Caribbean women, and how they make sense of their race, ethnicity and gender within the context of attending a Hispanic serving institution. During my research, I found the difference between what makes a first generation a first generation, and what makes a second generation a second generation. So I'm second generation American, and so...

Dra. Yvette Martinez-Vu

A lot of the folks that listen to this podcast are children of immigrants, are themselves first gen in college. Some of them may be first gen or second gen in the US. So can you expand a little bit more on that? Just to clarify for those that are like- their ears are perking up when you say that?

Dr. Emmanuela Stanislaus

Yeah, there's actually multi generations. Of course, scholars have to define things right? There is this tension between how scholars define things versus how people define themselves.

Dra. Yvette Martinez-Vu

Yes.

Dr. Emmanuela Stanislaus

There's always this battle about like, ooh, do you call- and I'll just use the Latinx community. Does the Latinx community call themselves Latinx, or do they call themselves Hispanic? There's always this tension about what people call themselves, versus what scholars and researchers say. But in the research, a first generation American would be those who first came to the land.

Dra. Yvette Martinez-Vu

Yes.

Dr. Emmanuela Stanislaus

So then my parents would be considered first generation, and the child that they have here on the land would be what would be second generation.

Dra. Yvette Martinez-Vu

Interesting.

Dr. Emmanuela Stanislaus

Some folks will just say first, whatever. But then also there's this piece of - depending on the age that you come to the United States, depending on if one parent is an immigrant versus one being a person from that country. I'm talking US context here. You would be considered 1.5 generation. There's so many levels to it. So that's kind of the difference. When you think of going to college, you're the first one to go to college, which would make sense that you're first generation.

Dra. Yvette Martinez-Vu

Yes. And I've heard of the 1.5 gen in college as well.

Dr. Emmanuela Stanislaus

Yup.

Dra. Yvette Martinez-Vu

For those who have parents who went to college in other countries. It's just interesting, the differences, the nuances in how we define first, second, and even continuing generations.

Dr. Emmanuela Stanislaus

Correct. Yeah, so that's why- even in my work, I had to kind of share that information and definition with others. But I definitely understand that folks will call themselves what they feel comfortable, and there's no wrong or right. But based on the literature, that's that. In addition to that, I consider myself Haitian- American, because my parents are Haitian, and their experience informs who I am. My parents, they also have experiences being entrepreneurs when they were in Haiti.

Dr. Emmanuela Stanislaus

My dad learned to be a tailor, and taught many folks in his city how to sew, in an effort to support their families. My mom also did all types of things in terms of selling goods, things like soap, deodorant, things likethat. That happens in developing countries where people need different things. And so that's part of me. My dad had a full time job when he came to the US, but continued to sew and make his own clothing and do things for other folks. He was always working on some type of side gig, which influenced me in a lot of ways- which is why I consider myself a multi- passionate person.

Dr. Emmanuela Stanislaus

Even while I was in college, I worked multiple jobs. Most of it was because of the need. My parents didn't have a ton of disposable income to support me while I was in college. So I worked in retail. I worked at Express. And then I had multiple on campus jobs, too. But then I found the value of being involved. I was involved in Greek life, student government, lecture series- bringing various people to campus to talk about different things. Then eventually, I found the life hack of becoming a resident assistant.

Dra. Yvette Martinez-Vu

Wait, life hack?

Dr. Emmanuela Stanislaus

Yeah. Well, I'll tell you why that was a life hack for me. Because instead of working three jobs, I could work one job- because on my institution, being an RA meant that you had your own room for free. So I didn't have to pay for that, and then I got a paycheck on top of that. It bought time for me. I was able to get even more involved. I was able to do other things, and not stretch myself too thin. So I would definitely recommend that folks go that route. When I did that, I did that for two years. At the end of - well, close to the midpoint of my senior year, my supervisor kind of sat me down and was like, you know what you would do great at? I said, what? She goes Student Affairs, higher education. I'm like, what is that? I have no idea what it is.

Dr. Emmanuela Stanislaus

But eventually, through research and that sort of thing- I was already engaged in higher education through all of my involvement and things of that nature. That kind of led me down this other track of going towards higher education, which is where my background is. Eventually I went to get my Master's degree in higher education. I got an assistantship in Residence Life, which is a continuation of the RA piece, where I got housing for free. And I said, if I don't get this, I'm not going. I'm not going to college- I never thought I would go and pursue my graduate degree.

Dr. Emmanuela Stanislaus

Now that I'm doing this- and my parents don't necessarily understand why I'm going to do this. You need to go out, graduate and make money, right? You're hesitating, or you're putting your life on hold for two years to do this thing. So I took the chance. I only applied to one grad program. I also put all my eggs in one basket to get that assistantship. And I got it. I got it through networking, through folks that I knew, through my job as an RA and their connections to the program. Then from there, I spent seventeen years in higher education, in both Res Life as well as career services. Then earning my doctorate in 2020. That is kind of my story.

Dra. Yvette Martinez-Vu

That is such a great story. I'm actually curious if you could tell us- what did you have in mind in terms of your career options before learning about student affairs? Like when you went into college, did you have an idea in mind of what to major in, what career direction you were gonna head into?

Dr. Emmanuela Stanislaus

I love that question, because it's all related to career development, right? I think that I changed my major so many times. Not officially, because back in the day, you had to fill out paperwork to do that. Now it's easy. Folks could just click a button or whatever.

Dra. Yvette Martinez-Vu

That's nice.

Dr. Emmanuela Stanislaus

Right?

Dra. Yvette Martinez-Vu

You don't have to run around and get all these signatures.

Dr. Emmanuela Stanislaus

Yeah. But I'm old school. So I had to get the paperwork, stand in line.

Dra. Yvette Martinez-Vu

Yup.

Dr. Emmanuela Stanislaus

Then, you know, get somebody else to do it. The dean has to sign off on it.

Dra. Yvette Martinez-Vu

That's why I didn't change majors.

Dr. Emmanuela Stanislaus

Right? Oh my gosh, the headache. These Gen Z's don't know what the world was like before that. So initially, when I first came to college, I wanted to be one of two things. I wanted to go into sports medicine or be a child psychologist.

Dra. Yvette Martinez-Vu

Oh, wow.

Dr. Emmanuela Stanislaus

Both things that would require an advanced degree, but I did not know that at that time. One of the things that led me to the degree I ended up pursuing was- one of the majors that I thought about was going into business, because I thought that was just broad. I could do a lot of things. And again, too, I always had this entrepreneurial mindset. Like okay, I'll probably go into business. I'll probably own my own business one day, that kind of thing. So one summer, I went home, and I was doing some temp work at the port of Everglades. The port of Everglades is- I don't even know what it is now, if it's privately owned or whatever. But it was part of the city and it was managed through the city- that sort of thing.

Dr. Emmanuela Stanislaus

I was supporting them as an admin. And back then- again, because I'm old- they had a literal job board. It was a bulletin board with the jobs posted on there- what was available, that sort of thing. During that time, I would look at them just to see. I was a sophomore in college, that sort of thing. I would look at them, and a lot of the jobs required a Bachelor's degree in business or public administration. At the time, I was struggling with with business, because they had- and still do- have this pipeline issue of the what is it? Calculus for business, which is a bottleneck. It's a way to kind of...

Dra. Yvette Martinez-Vu

Oh, the "weeder classes?"

Dr. Emmanuela Stanislaus

Exactly.

Dra. Yvette Martinez-Vu

Oh, okay.

Dr. Emmanuela Stanislaus

Yes, which- we're looking at you higher ed. That is not fair what you're doing, because we know what happens. Anyway...

Dra. Yvette Martinez-Vu

Who it pushes out. We know that.

Dr. Emmanuela Stanislaus

Exactly. So because of that, I was like, I need to find an easier route. I had not thought about public administration at that time. And so I'm like, that is probably something equivalent, right? That could get me into the public sphere if I wanted to, and maybe I can use it to get into business as well. So that is what I did. I declared my major in public administration. I saw that my institution had that major, and I minored in entrepreneurship. At that time, no one knew what entrepreneurship was, but that was my thing. I really wanted to - at that time- go into being a lobbyist. I wanted to go full on into the public sphere. But I didn't explore that. I mean, there's still time. I could definitely look at that in the future. But yeah, that was what I wanted to do.

Dra. Yvette Martinez-Vu

I appreciate you sharing this- your background- because it's so telling about where you are today, and also how thoughtful and strategic you were about considering your major and its implications for your career options. That's great. I know I was not as thoughtful in my own major options. I wish I had known- actually, I have a quite the opposite experience in that my I grew up watching my mom being a business owner and entrepreneur. She has her own religious article store, a botanica. And seeing her struggle- even though she's her own boss, has her own schedule. I was like, nope. I'm gonna get a nine to five. I'm gonna have a stable paycheck. No, no no. I'm not gonna do what she does. And I'm just laughing at myself, because growing up, I was always like, I'm not gonna be like my mom. Now as I get older, I'm more and more like her.

Dr. Emmanuela Stanislaus

Look at that. Isn't that weird how life works?

Dra. Yvette Martinez-Vu

Yeah.

Dr. Emmanuela Stanislaus

And how you can be so close to something and you see it not as something that you want to pursue. I had the opposite. I'm like, no. I want to go the entrepreneurial route. But I will say this, too, which is an important part of my story. I got connected with the University Career Center pretty early on.

Dra. Yvette Martinez-Vu

That's great.

Dr. Emmanuela Stanislaus

Yeah, I was one of the folks who- I wanted to use every service that I possibly could, and the Career Center was one of those for me. I was lucky- and I know, my story isn't the same for a lot of folks, where I connected with a career advisor who- he was a black male. He could understand my point of view, my background, and I didn't feel like I couldn't be my whole self.

Dra. Yvette Martinez-Vu

Yes.

Dr. Emmanuela Stanislaus

All of those kinds of things really helped me to feel comfortable in sharing what I wanted to do, and just seeing value in the resources. Not too many people get that experience. And I know because I've led various University Career Centers, and a lot of folks- students- have a hard time connecting with the Career Center. Career Center staff tend to be mostly white, older folks too. If you don't see folks who look like you, or if you go and you have a bad experience, or you feel like you can't bring your full self, then you're never going to go there. You're not going to see value in in that space.

Dr. Emmanuela Stanislaus

So early on, I connected with that career counselor. Then as a resident assistant, I would bring him in for programming that I would do for my residents on interviewing skills, resume writing, and things like that. I tried to pay it forward to some of my residents and things like that. I would go to different college campuses with my friends, and I would go and stop at the career centers and get all of the booklets that they would have. Because I just thought that they all had different things- but it was really one vendor. But they would put the university brand on it.

Dra. Yvette Martinez-Vu

Logos, yeah. I know because I had a similar habit. I love collecting booklets and handouts and even created lots of binders.

Dr. Emmanuela Stanislaus

Right? Yeah, that was a fun thing.

Dra. Yvette Martinez-Vu

Like actual- I was like, no, not digital. Everything was papers- paper and binders.

Dr. Emmanuela Stanislaus

I love it.

Dra. Yvette Martinez-Vu

It's so funny. Well, this is so fitting. Actually, you're reminding me of- this is the importance of representation, representation of spaces that you're in there. Because you saw someone that you yourself could relate to, could feel like you could express yourself, you were able to get access to resources and information to benefit your career. So it's great to have you on to talk about career development, because for me, when I think about career development in relation to undergraduates and graduate students- those are the folks that primarily listen to this podcast. It's not a topic that's commonly talked about.

Dra. Yvette Martinez-Vu

There is this assumption- a lot of students hold this misconception that when you go to your graduate program, they're going to deliver everything that you need to know to get the career that you intend to do. Like, isn't that why I'm getting my MSW? So they can teach me and help me get that job as a social worker? Isn't that why I'm becoming a- I don't know, getting an EdD to become a professional in higher education? Or isn't that why - you can go a number of different directions with your advanced degree. And there is this assumption- and some programs, more practical, more applied programs may provide some of that. They may have a coach. They may have internships. But more often than not, they don't. So for those that are listening to this, and this is their first introduction to career development 101, what is career development? How is it different from the type of professional development that they might get in a graduate program, especially Master's, PhD programs?

Dr. Emmanuela Stanislaus

I love that question, and I love what you said before that too. I hope we can come back to it. Well, maybe I'll start the answer with that.

Dra. Yvette Martinez-Vu

Yeah.

Dr. Emmanuela Stanislaus

You are, right on, spot on, where folks kind of expect that these programs, your university, your graduate program, will have these things built in. And I will say- I was having this conversation with- I think it was my husband the other day. Really think about- how often do you, or when you've ever had a conversation about your career goals with a professor? And had that conversation to where they initiated that conversation?

Dr. Emmanuela Stanislaus

I never had a faculty member sit down and ask me, what do you want to do? And help me strategize where I want to go with the degree that I want to do and things like that. That's why I do what I do as a coach, because I know that these conversations aren't happening. I have so many clients that I work with that don't know what to do. They choose majors, they choose programs, and they're waiting for the faculty or advisors to help them out. It never happens. That's why I think it's so important to take matters into your own hands and realize what the difference is.

Dr. Emmanuela Stanislaus

For me, when I think of professional development versus career development, professional development is really linked to skills enhancement. A lot of times, folks will say they want to learn about a particular software. When you're learning that particular software, and the energy that you're putting towards that, that is professional development. That's going to help you to get to your end goal of enhancing that skill, right?

Dr. Emmanuela Stanislaus

Whereas career development is really related to everything that is a part of your career. It's the whole package. For example, you might- like I said, we talked about the skills piece with the professional development. But on the career development side, you might want to go from an entry level position to a manager- managerial or a VP role. So the career development piece is all of the steps that will take you to demonstrate your expertise, to set you apart from other folks, to establish and build your network, establish your brand, all of those things that help you to show that you're a valuable member of the team or you're a valuable asset that someone can hire you for. That is career development.

Dr. Emmanuela Stanislaus

So a lot of us have to engage in career management, right? How are you making sure that you're positioning yourself correctly? How are you making sure that you are internally having those conversations with yourself in terms of like, where do I see myself in six months? Where do I see myself five years from now? Then reverse engineering it to see, what do you have to do to get to that point?

Dra. Yvette Martinez-Vu

Oh, you just mentioned a couple of phrases. I'm just like, hold up. This is good. You said, first career development, then career management. Are those two in the same or are they different?

Dr. Emmanuela Stanislaus

Well, personally, I think that they're different. Well, they could be similar in some cases, but they could be different, because the management part is you assessing and seeing. It's like the project management piece of it.

Dra. Yvette Martinez-Vu

Yeah.

Dr. Emmanuela Stanislaus

But then the career development piece, that could be all of the steps that you're taking to accomplish the career goal that you have, if that makes sense.

Dra. Yvette Martinez-Vu

Then you mentioned reverse engineering. I'm thinking hold up, hold up. I know a reverse engineering is. I love it. That's my jam. But what is reverse engineering for folks who maybe have not heard of it? Or they've heard of it, but they struggle with planning. They're like, wait. I had actually a client asked me this question- I've been learning more about reverse planning or reverse engineering, and I'm stuck, because I don't know. Like, how do you work from the end in sight if you have to start at the beginning? I have my own answer. But I'm curious. So what is reverse engineering, and how does it apply to this whole conversation of career development? If you can just expand a little bit more.

Dr. Emmanuela Stanislaus

Yeah, that's a good question. You're right. I think part of it is because I used to work with engineering students. So I'm always thinking about that. When you think about it, engineers are always tinkering, right? They're trying to solve a problem. A lot of times, that is done from the problem side. But then if you're reverse engineering, you're kind of- and I'll use the career as an example. Reverse engineering would be like- you see this for yourself. You're envisioning yourself five steps ahead.

Dr. Emmanuela Stanislaus

I want to, I don't know, I want to be on- I can't think of an example right now. But like, I want to be a manager. I want to go up one level.

Dra. Yvette Martinez-Vu

Yeah.

Dr. Emmanuela Stanislaus

I am not in a manager role right now. You want to work backwards to see- how is it that I can get from this point to that point? So the reverse engineering is like, going steps back to say- these are the things that will potentially get me to that role. Thinking backwards from where you want to be. Hopefully, that's a good...

Dra. Yvette Martinez-Vu

Yeah, it is. Also, you know, thinking back. We mentioned earlier about how in graduate school, career development isn't necessarily a priority, and how professors will rarely- if ever- ask you about your career interests. They're not career coaches.

Dr. Emmanuela Stanislaus

Yeah.

Dra. Yvette Martinez-Vu

But then also, you might think, okay, when I go into my first professional job, I am going to have a manager who's going to keep an eye out on me, and who's going to see how amazing I am. And is this gonna get me a promotion? I think this happens a lot. There's this conversation that goes on in a lot of our heads- especially when you're first, first in your family to enter these industries.

Dra. Yvette Martinez-Vu

But I'm sorry to be the bearer of bad news. In a lot of industries and across the field, there are a lot of managers who may not necessarily be trained to be great managers, be trained to be watching over you and thinking about your career. They're worried about their own careers. Even if they were, it really is up to you- not for you to follow someone else's goals and dreams for you. So yeah, I'm glad that you mentioned the reverse engineering side of things, because you can reverse engineer in any aspect of your life. It can happen in grad school. It can happen in your job. It can happen in any- in your personal life, too.

Dr. Emmanuela Stanislaus

Yeah. You just bring up- that's whole point too that I definitely wanted to share too, that I got caught up in as a first gen everything. Even first gen professional- working in a professional environment when my parents didn't necessarily work in white collar types of environments, and couldn't really support me in some of the experiences that I had. But I really thought that meritocracy was real.

Dra. Yvette Martinez-Vu

Yeah.

Dr. Emmanuela Stanislaus

It really wasn't until later in life- as I had my head down, buried, doing good work, thinking that folks would recognize that, they would reward that- that I realized that meritocracy is not real. A lot of us, especially children of immigrants, are told that- from our parents, because they believed that's what would happen. Then we see other folks who are less talented than us, mediocre folks that are getting ahead quicker than us. They're getting paid more than us. We are also given more work, because we're diligent workers. So it's almost like we're punished in a way

Dra. Yvette Martinez-Vu

Yeah.

Dr. Emmanuela Stanislaus

Getting additional work, but not more pay to compensate for that additional labor. So I just wanted to stress that it's important for us to not go down that hole. I think that's where career development and career management will help you to do certain things, position yourself in certain ways, so that you can have those conversations. Don't wait for folks to have conversations with you. Tell them, this is what I want to do. Or I want to grow, what areas do you think that I should work on? If you're not really sure of what direction you want your career to go. You can either share what you want, or ask for more feedback, so that you can kind of, you know, get to where you want to be. Advocating for yourself, speaking up, and not necessarily just leaning on what you're doing. Because a lot of times, it's not about that. It's about who you know, the relationships that you're building, and the story that you're telling about yourself.

Dra. Yvette Martinez-Vu

Yeah, and it brings me back to even what I shared earlier about what you do. In your bio, you say- helping people to take back control or taking their power back? That's the career development aspect of it. I had questions that I wanted to ask you, but the conversation is so interesting, because you mentioned storytelling. Now I'm like, okay, let's talk about storytelling. Because I do think that that's very important, and not something that everybody might think about- especially if they don't come from a humanities or social science background, where they're not necessarily taught about the importance of storytelling in our career. Can you say a little bit more about what you mean by that?

Dr. Emmanuela Stanislaus

Yeah. I think it's really about the way that you are thinking about the way that you brand yourself.

Dra. Yvette Martinez-Vu

Yes.

Dr. Emmanuela Stanislaus

I strongly believe- a lot of times I'll talk about it on the podcast or share it with my clients- that branding is important. When we think about branding, you can think about some of your most favorite brands, whether it's- some of my favorites are Apple, Target, Sephora. All of these brands make you feel a certain way. They make you spend money, right? Branding has the power to move people. So you have to think about what you want to be known for, you have to think about where you want to go, which is why that reverse engineering is so important.

Dr. Emmanuela Stanislaus

If you want to be known for x, you have to start talking about x. You have to start sharing how much you know about x. That's a part of your story, right? Because that- you talking about X, Y and Z. Like for instance, I'm talking about career development and I'm sharing my story around how I got to know about career development and how I worked in career services.

Dra. Yvette Martinez-Vu

Yes.

Dr. Emmanuela Stanislaus

Why I think it's so important for grad students, especially because of the traps that I fell into with meritocracy. How faculty weren't there for me when I thought that they would be. And how that now is leading me to talk about it on my podcast, to put out a book too. I do have a book that's an ebook that's going to be coming out, specifically geared towards career development for graduate students. Because I think it's so important that we get this information in the hands of first gen students, of students of color. Because all of us don't have it.

Dra. Yvette Martinez-Vu

Yeah.

Dr. Emmanuela Stanislaus

We don't have it. A lot of folks don't really share it. If they know the information, they kind of hoard it. That's why I think it's so important to be able to share our stories, because through our stories, we can share our expertise. We can brand ourselves and we can get what we want. We can get the career that we want, and not necessarily feel like we're stuck. We're stuck in a particular career path.

Dra. Yvette Martinez-Vu

And I really feel like when you understand your personal branding, you understand your mission, your vision, your goals, your values, you're set up to land a job that's going to be in alignment, that's going to bring you some sort of, I don't know, pleasure, joy, meaning.

Dr. Emmanuela Stanislaus

Yeah, I agree. And I never think of purpose, but it's like, what problems do you want to solve? In the book too- it's so funny that you talk about your mission. Thinking about the values that you have, what you want out of a organization that you join. What do you want out of your supervisors? All of those kinds of things are important before you start the job search process, right? That's even important before you think about going into grad school as well. Career development starts before you submit the application.

Dra. Yvette Martinez-Vu

Right.

Dr. Emmanuela Stanislaus

You want to do your research. Like, what is it that you want this degree to do? What type of lifestyle do you want? How is this program going to get you there? Really doing research on the faculty too. Is this the right set of faculty that can get me to the goal that I want? Then once you apply- or when you're applying, you're looking for positions, not positions, but programs and faculty that will get you what it is that you want. Then before you start, you can create the plan. You can create a plan of action that will help you get the career that you want.

Dr. Emmanuela Stanislaus

Once you step foot- maybe you want community. You want to build that network. So first off, creating a support group of folks. Maybe you meet bi weekly, or whatever the case is. Support each other with your writing goals, your reading goals, network and potentially collaborate on projects, maybe writing articles, all of those kinds of things. Sit down with your faculty member, ask those critical questions. All of those things are going to help you to plant the seed to help you to get to the end goal that you want.

Dra. Yvette Martinez-Vu

You also mentioned earlier that not everybody's open with sharing. Some folks definitely gatekeep information. But in light of sharing, I'm curious about- you've been sharing a lot. But are there any other things that you wished you knew about career development and career managemet, personal branding, designing the life that you want? What are some of the things that maybe you wish you knew when you were in grad school or even in undergrad?

Dr. Emmanuela Stanislaus

That's a great question. I think I come back to that whole meritocracy thing.

Dra. Yvette Martinez-Vu

Oh my goodness, yes.

Dr. Emmanuela Stanislaus

Right? If I would have known that earlier- because I knew all of the other things. I knew branding. I knew how to set up my resume. I knew how to job search. I knew how to examine a job description, and help that to help me craft my story and why folks should hire me over someone else. But I wish I knew the meritocracy thing, because I think that kind of competed with all of the other information that I knew. And I'm sure Gen Z's and younger millennials got the lesson sooner than I did. But as a first gen college student, like I said, I was just trying to navigate things and managing what my parents shared with me too, and what I thought would work out. That was something that kind of burned me and so I learned the hard lesson, that a lot of times, it's not who you what you know, but who you know.

Dr. Emmanuela Stanislaus

That's kind of tied to maybe another lesson too, of the power of networking. Whenever possible, getting out there, expanding your network, because I've even seen personally, the value of how knowing someone and them knowing what you bring to the table can bring opportunities that you may not have been exposed to in the past. There's a stat too about that- 70% of jobs that are posted. Sorry, 70% of jobs aren't posted.

Dra. Yvette Martinez-Vu

Yeah.

Dr. Emmanuela Stanislaus

A lot of times, it really depends on who you know. I think with that, it might make sense to share some recommendations, because a lot of times folks are like, what do I do with that? But talking to faculty outside of class classes, talking to your classmates outside of the class setting as well, so that you can build trust and that sort of thing. Attending an alumni event. Those are great ways for you to talk to other folks and kind of share what you want.

Dra. Yvette Martinez-Vu

Yeah.

Dr. Emmanuela Stanislaus

So having goals that are tied to your networking event that you're going to, and this is...

Dra. Yvette Martinez-Vu

Doing that early on, too.

Dr. Emmanuela Stanislaus

Yes.

Dra. Yvette Martinez-Vu

I wanted to mention this as an example. I know that a lot of folks will think- well, I need to network as soon as I'm ready to apply for the job, and then tell people that I'm applying for the job. But one of the best networking individuals that I know- one of my former mentees- his name's Jamal. I love that recently, he went on Twitter. He's got this big following. He's very good at networking, and was like, the time has come. I'm going on the job market.

Dr. Emmanuela Stanislaus

Oh wow, okay.

Dra. Yvette Martinez-Vu

There's a whole thread of his background, his experience, blah, blah, blah, links to some of his work- and a bunch of retweets. I thought to myself, this is it. This is such a great example of someone who has been building up the network, and then lays it all out when when he's ready. Again, if I could go back in time and do things a little differently, with more kind of strategy in mind, being more thoughtful, considerate about these things, I would have put myself out there a little bit more. I did not, and I don't know how many folks are actively putting themselves out there right now, because maybe they're putting it off. There's so much, everybody's so busy. And they think they have time, or they're just too feeling shy or introverted or more intimidated. There's so many things that can get in the way from networking. But hopefully, you and I can remind them that it's worth it.

Dr. Emmanuela Stanislaus

It is worth it. And if you go with goals- because I'm introverted. A lot of folks don't know that. I can stare at a wall. I could just be at home, and just get all of my energy from there. So before I go to a networking event, I have goals. I'm like, okay, I want to speak to three people, and I want to make sure that I share about X. This is my goal. Or maybe I have a person that I'm wanting to meet there, specifically. I think that I thrive more when I have those goals, because once that three is met, then I feel a sense of ease. Like, okay, the pressures off. I already did, I achieved the goal. I love checking things off my list.

Dra. Yvette Martinez-Vu

Yeah.

Dr. Emmanuela Stanislaus

Going there with a goal, a lot of times, will help you. If you just go there- sometimes you just feel like you're aimlessly walking around, or maybe you're staying with the same people. You know, all of those kinds of things. So I would definitely encourage folks to go in with goals, then follow up with the folks, and build the relationship before you need it- just like your mentee.

Dra. Yvette Martinez-Vu

Yeah. I feel like you shared some really, really great tips, and you shared a lot of insights about what you wish you had known. Do you have any other words of advice for first gen students of color, who are just curious about the topic of career development, still trying to navigate where they're going in their career- especially for the folks who are feeling a little lost? Or who may be not lost, but they just are multi passionate and don't realize it. Any words of advice folks like that?

Dr. Emmanuela Stanislaus

Well, for my multi passionate people, don't be down on yourself. You do not have to have one thing that you like. And this is said as someone who- I didn't share this earlier, but I used to be a wedding and event planner. I was a travel blogger.

Dra. Yvette Martinez-Vu

Wow.

Dr. Emmanuela Stanislaus

I was working in career services, and now I have my consulting business. All of these are a part of me, you know what I mean? So you grow, you evolve, and that sort of thing. There's nothing wrong with that. I wanted to make sure that you all know that. The other thing I would say is that it's never too late or early to start working on your career development. I think that there's so much advice that I really want to share.

Dr. Emmanuela Stanislaus

One of them that I would share is- I know this is the Femtoring podcast.

Dra. Yvette Martinez-Vu

Yeah.

Dr. Emmanuela Stanislaus

It's super important to have mentors. However, I think one thing that we need to kind of think about is this whole concept of having a personal board of directors. When you think of-

Dra. Yvette Martinez-Vu

Ooh.

Dr. Emmanuela Stanislaus

Right? I didn't invent that. I just wanted to share that. I heard about this topic from a keynote speaker maybe about twelve years ago at a conference, and I've just held on to this and have been on my soapbox, just trying to share it with other folks. The idea is, around corporations, organizations, they have their board of directors. The board of directors are there to help steer the organization to accomplish its goals. And the personal board of directors is the same thing. So instead of- a lot of folks, especially first gen students are thinking oh, they just have one mentor.

Dr. Emmanuela Stanislaus

But with this, you would have- I would recommend between six and eight people who are from different backgrounds, gender, age, experiences, not necessarily all in your industry. These are folks that you can call on to give you advice throughout your career. You may have folks who are there to give you personal advice. You might have folks on there to give you advice on your career or navigating different types of settings. So the idea is that you're not calling on one person all of the time, but you can rotate it, and have folks who can help you along that journey. Connecting with them face to face, over the phone, or thorugh - I don't know - emails, helping them to know what's going on with you, having a different checkpoint, so that they know what your interests are, what your goals are, and can help you however they can.

Dr. Emmanuela Stanislaus

Now the other side to that, that I like to kind of encourage folks to do is to not just be the person just taking, taking, taking, but also giving too.

Dra. Yvette Martinez-Vu

Yes.

Dr. Emmanuela Stanislaus

You have skills that you can provide your board of directors that can help make their lives easier. I would say, see how you can support them and what they want to do, so that it's a two way type of relationship. I would totally recommend that among other things, but for sure that.

Dra. Yvette Martinez-Vu

I really like that, because I also think that that relates to another common misconception in graduate school, which is that you will be paired with a mentor or advisor that's your go to for all things. And I like to remind people- your advisor is not going to be perfect, and they're not going to be able to help you in all areas of your career and profession. It's useful to have multiple people you can count on, reach out to. It also helps you have a better perspective, because you're getting different inputs, as opposed to just relying on one person's opinion on something.

Dr. Emmanuela Stanislaus

Exactly.

Dra. Yvette Martinez-Vu

I really like that, the personal board of directors.

Dr. Emmanuela Stanislaus

Yes.

Dra. Yvette Martinez-Vu

Now, we're getting close to wrapping up. Do you have any other closing words? I know you said you have a lot of words of advice. You've shared a lot already. Just curious if there's anything you want to leave our listeners with?

Dr. Emmanuela Stanislaus

Yeah, I think I'll probably leave you all with two things that I probably haven't talked about before. One of them is LinkedIn. I think it's super important for everyone to be on LinkedIn. That's a natural, easy way for you to establish your brand. Make sure you have a good headshot. Go on there, have a compelling way to describe yourself as well as your experiences. Connect with folks. Start conversations. I would say that is one tool that a lot of first gens are kind of intimidated by. But I would definitely encourage you to do that and connect with me if you want. That is one piece of the career development piece that I want to share. Another piece too that I think is super undervalued is the power of informational interviews to help you with your career goals. You know, you've heard...

Dra. Yvette Martinez-Vu

I sound like a broken record, because I say that to everybody. People think it's just for industry. I'm like, no, for grad school too, for higher ed too. You want to become a professor? It's important too.

Dr. Emmanuela Stanislaus

For everything, yes. Please do that if you don't do anything else. I have had so many opportunities come up because of informational interviews, where you can plant the seed for what you want. These are great for establishing support, exploring potential paths, interests, and expanding your network. Like I said, I use this all the time. So try to identify folks that you would want to meet with. Maybe it's someone that you look up to. Maybe it's someone that potentially, that you would like to have on your personal board of directors. Maybe it's for grad school too, like we talked about.

Dr. Emmanuela Stanislaus

And the idea is that you can sit down with them- twenty, thirty minutes. Learn about their career trajectory. Ask important questions that can get you to learn more about either their career path- because maybe you have an interest in that- or a particular industry. Use that to kind of share what you want to do. And maybe that can open up the door for you to meet someone else, because you can end it off by asking, is there someone else that you think that I should speak to that can help me to do X, or help me to get a better grasp of Y? Those would be two things that I really want to stress to grad students, first gen students, to take advantage of.

Dra. Yvette Martinez-Vu

You came here with all the gems. I just want to say to everybody, you're welcome. Brought on Dr. Emmanuela, who came in to share a lot of valuable lessons with everyone. For folks who resonated and who want to follow you, or be in touch, connect, listen more to you, your podcasts- tell us a little bit more about how folks can reach you, how they can listen to your podcast, and maybe even how they can work with you.

Dr. Emmanuela Stanislaus

Awesome. Yay. Thank you so much. This has been so fun. I love talking about career development.

Dra. Yvette Martinez-Vu

I feel like such a nerd, because I really love talking about these things, too.

Dr. Emmanuela Stanislaus

Yeah, it's great. If folks want to follow me, I'm on most social media as @Dr.Emmanuela. I'm most active on Twitter, Instagram, and getting on Tik Tok as well. I'm on LinkedIn as well, as Dr. Emmanuela. If you're a graduate student or anyone interested in learning more about the doctoral journey, I definitely invite you to check out my podcast, which is Writing On My Mind, where I have revealing conversations with folks who have either completed or are pursuing their doctorate degrees, in an effort to help current graduate students to level up, as I shared.

Dr. Emmanuela Stanislaus

I'm a qualitative researcher through and through, and believe in the power of stories to help us liberate ourselves. That's why we have those conversations. And then, as I shared before too, I have the career development book for graduate students that will be dropping in October- October 10th. I'll definitely share the link with you, Dr. Yvette.

Dra. Yvette Martinez-Vu

Great, we will add it.

Dr. Emmanuela Stanislaus

So that folks can get that when it does drop. We will be having pre sales of that as well. The book will talk a lot about what we've kind of talked about today. It gives practical steps and tips for establishing your brand, looking at how you set up your resume for the job search, how to expand your network as well. So some advice, but then also workbook activities too, to help make that process easier. If anyone wants to connect with me, they can visit my website as well which is Dr.EmmanuelaConsulting.com. I have coaching available, as well as I come out to different institutions to talk about topics such as this.

Dra. Yvette Martinez-Vu

Amazing. Well, thank you so much, Dr. Emmanuela, for coming today to the show, for sharing all these amazing gems, for- I feel like- just having a fun chat with us today. It was so great to hear from you.

Dr. Emmanuela Stanislaus

Thank you so much for having me.