113: Personal Brand Design and the Business of Personal Development with Dr. Lauren Mason Carris

Dra. Yvette Martinez-Vu

All right, welcome everyone to another episode of the Grad School Femtoring Podcast. I am, I always say I'm really excited because I genuinely am really excited each time. But I have another amazing guest. It's actually my first guest for 2022. So it's also my first guest after my move abroad. So that's kind of nice. And we this person is gonna be talking to us all about personal brand design, and the business of personal development. So I'm gonna go ahead and read her bio.

Dra. Yvette Martinez-Vu

Our guest is Dr. Lauren Mason Carris, who is the VP of learning design at Penny AI, a global SASS tech company where she designed and I hope I said that right S A S S or is it SASS? So global SASS tech company where she designs learning strategies to increase performance, improve user experience and lead a culture of learning.

Dra. Yvette Martinez-Vu

As a self identified intersectional Jew-tina first generation academic and first generation of technologists, Lauren is no stranger to living on the margins, and questioning her sense of belonging personally and professionally. She uses her own experiences and scholarship on identity formation, social belonging, and learning science to inform user experience improvements, and help her mentees across sectors evolved from imposter syndrome to defining and refining a strong personal brand. Yay. Welcome to the podcast, Dra. Lauren.

Dr. Lauren Mason Carris

Yeah, thank you so much for having me. It's really exciting. This is apart from the day to day work that I'm doing. You know, in my, in my role that you just described, this is my first engagement of 2020. So yeah, here we are.

Dra. Yvette Martinez-Vu

We're so lucky to have you. So I'm gonna have you start off the way that most of my guests start off, I typically ask them to share a little bit more about themselves, their background, their backstory, and educational trajectory. Sometimes I know, folks, sometimes I don't know, folks, sometimes I think I know them, and then I find out more about them. So please, share, you know, whatever it is that you're comfortable sharing about your background, your trajectory, you know, first personnel professional, overhead.

Dr. Lauren Mason Carris

Cool. All right, well, I'm going to anchor this actually in the way that you and I came to know each other. And, in fact, it's such a pleasure to, to be here and to participate as a guest. To see you in in your element and to see you shine, you know, bringing great work to, to the students that you engage with and to the future professionals really, you know, that resonate with your message.

Dr. Lauren Mason Carris

And why is that important? Well, because you and I met is a mentor mentee relationship. Back in the day, when I was actually my graduate program at UCLA, I was in applied linguistics, and I personally was looking for a home. I was looking for a network and a community of like minded and and like experienced intersectional humans, where I could actually find support and community and also give back to providing support and community throughout my personal experience.

Dr. Lauren Mason Carris

And I found that home through Dr. LaTonya Reese Miles, LT, she's like the anchor that connects us all right. But yeah, I came to know her through actually some of my, it wasn't work study, because I was in graduate, you know, my graduate program, but it was the work I was doing while I was studying. And I, I worked with her husband actually at the Office of Instructional Technology at UCLA. He told me about his amazing wife and I saw her at events.

Dr. Lauren Mason Carris

And I was like, oh my gosh, she's just so inspiring. Like, what is her deal? What does she do? And, yeah, she got me connected with the McNair Scholars Program, and I applied to be a mentor. And that experience of actually applying to be a mentor was the first time in my graduate career that I started to really unpack and reflect and question and come to understand my place in academia is a different story as an undergrad, but as a graduate student that was the first time in the first community where I could explicitly explore those intersectionalities? And it was also through that experience that I was your mentor.

Dra. Yvette Martinez-Vu

I share the story that I share the story usually about applying to McNair and how hard I work and how much you know, I came and got support. And if you were the person that was giving me that support

Dr. Lauren Mason Carris

And if they're listening to prior episodes, they can be like, oh, yeah, here we go.

Dra. Yvette Martinez-Vu

And it's funny, because then I didn't end up getting into McNair but and yet, I feel like there's this ripple effect, because I did end up getting into the Mellon Mays program. And so I feel like there's definitely that connection. And it's thanks to the support of folks like you, folks like Marissa Lopez, who became my, my faculty mentor that truly believed in me. And then LT continued to mentor, even the folks who didn't get into McNair.

Dra. Yvette Martinez-Vu

So that's like, that, to me is really meaningful. The fact that she gave back even after like, folks like me, didn't get in, we'd reach out, we'd ask her, you know, for support for, you know, input feedback, and she was always there. So, yes, that's, that's, that was how we met, I distinctly remember coming to you for guidance for support, and you were just, you never made me feel like, even though I was brand new to research, like I didn't belong, or like, my work wasn't good enough. And, and I believe that you made me believe in myself enough to apply, because it felt like such a big deal was such a new program for me back then. So thank you.

Dr. Lauren Mason Carris

Oh, my goodness, you're so welcome. And I have to say, for all of your listeners, it's, I think anyone who goes into any kind of mentoring work, or teaching or engages with people who are at an early point in in their own personal journeys, to see them grow and evolve, I can't tell you how many times well, you could probably look at statistics on social media, but event, so many times you lit up my feed, you know, with excitement because of what you're doing and how you're progressing. And I felt so honored to be like, yes, I played a small role in that. And so, you know, the power of mentoring and mentorship I think is so powerful, obviously, as you know, Grad School Femtoring goes.

Dra. Yvette Martinez-Vu

And it's so interesting, because then it was another one of your femtees that recommended you to the podcast. And I was like, oh my gosh, I know her!

Dr. Lauren Mason Carris

Indeed, it's a small world. Yeah. Yeah. So big nod to Stephanie there.

Dra. Yvette Martinez-Vu

Yeah. Shout out to Stephanie. So we brought you here, you came on here to talk a little bit about personal branding. And I feel like this is a really good time to talk about it at the start of the year, as people are kind of like setting intentions and setting goals and thinking about their work and how it applies, you know, both within you know, most of my listeners are undergrads interested in grad school or current grad students trying to navigate academia and, and thinking about their options, their career options.

Dra. Yvette Martinez-Vu

So I think it's kind of really relevant as they plan as I said, their short and long term goals to think about this topic of a branding and personal brand design and just kind of introduce these concepts, if they're new to them, to the listeners, so I would love to hear your input on on that. Like, what, for folks who aren't aware? Like, can you tell us a little bit about what is personal brand design? And what does it mean for for folks in grad school or considering grad school?

Dr. Lauren Mason Carris

Yeah, yeah. So branding in the concept of branding actually comes out of marketing. And so if you look, you know, quote, unquote, in industry, businesses and products, and in some cases, in your case Yvette, you are the product, right, you are producing a podcast as a support for individuals, but it is you and your connections, and you are the product and the brand, right? And well and that's exactly what I was gonna say was you have to actively work to brand yourself, right?

Dr. Lauren Mason Carris

What is what are the values, you know, that align with your personal brand? What are the interests? What are the boundaries, right? What are the talents and skills that you want to highlight and feature of yourself just as if you were working on branding of let's say, a popular like physical product like a Nike shoe? Right? A Nike sneaker you know, has specific values and specific design and specific things that it is not. Right, you're not going to find big old tacones on a, you know, on a Nike sneaker that you're going to, you know, wear, you know, to. I'm thinking of examples, and then I'm finding a counter example every time, which I'm struggling. You would want to wear them on her quinceanera dress. I don't know.

Dr. Lauren Mason Carris

But the point is, you know exactly what it is, is right. And I think, for anyone that's early in their career, and particularly for first generation, graduate students, because we are constantly questioning our personal identities, and constantly being evaluated about who we are and how we fit in. As much as we are questioning that ourselves, it becomes this really murky space. And it's not until now later in my career outside of academia, they see the value of really intentionally jotting down and crafting just like you do in vision boarding just like you do in, you know, aspirational, goal setting.

Dr. Lauren Mason Carris

What is the brand that I aspire to be right? Forget the job title, forget the number of scholarly articles that you're going to write, forget the journals that you're going to be a part of, like, apart from all of that, when you strip that all away. Who are you? And how do you present yourself? And how do you want people to know you? And I really have to acknowledge actually one of the startup before Penny AI, which was Find Your Grind, and really transformational curriculum that was about getting to understand yourself first, and really doing that work to explore what are my personal values? What are my personal interests? What innate talents and skills do I have? What are the things that people always compliment me on?

Dr. Lauren Mason Carris

Like, forget and shut out the noise around you, but really do that reflection, and consider what you want to, to adapt and evolve into. Right? So without it being a self limiting belief. Without it being a reductive strategy, like I'm not able to do these things like just acknowledge who you are, what you value, what you bring to the table, and how you want to evolve into that. And these exercises really are so powerful, then, in turning off the extra noise that or the the questions or the the questioning of yourself the doubts that I think really trickled in and sometimes hold us back.

Dra. Yvette Martinez-Vu

You just shared so much. And and I feel like this is all new to me. I mean, this is all just as of maybe two years ago, I started thinking about this. And even just recently, I've been trying to be more intentional about it. And I don't think that most students in college or even in grad school, depending on their program. But I feel like most students, especially if they're first gen, especially if they're students of color, they don't necessarily get that information of like be intentional about who you are, and what your values are, and what you're good at, and what your brand is.

Dra. Yvette Martinez-Vu

And sometimes branding itself can seem like, like a negative thing. Like it's a hyper capitalistic thing. And maybe that's why they're going towards academia, although it's capitalistic in its own way. But I'm wondering, so I think that that the the term that stands out to me and that I use a lot is that term of kind of being intentional, because for so long, some of us have been receiving this message these messages of like, doing what other people want us to do, of people pleasing for the perfectionism, the following kind of a safe track or whatever they think is like, the career that's going to lead them to, to be able to pay their bills and live the life that they want.

Dra. Yvette Martinez-Vu

But it's I found myself in the conversations I've had with my own friends my own family that not a lot of people actually sit down and have that conversation like who am I? Like what do I value? What do I believe in? Like, what do I stand for? What are my strengths? And then the limiting beliefs sometimes come up to where it's like well, I don't know and and so I'm wondering like, how can we make it more tangible you you mentioned like how did you learn I want to know how did you get to to even to the point where you're at now because you started you got your PhD and remind me you were in your in the social sciences got your PhD I'm not sure he went the tenure track route or if you knew right away right after graduation, that you're gonna be kind of pursuing something outside of academia.

Dr. Lauren Mason Carris

Yeah, so I didn't know, I really didn't, I gravitated towards, frankly, opportunities. So you could say it's opportunistic, and it's, you know, whatever capitalistic, but I think, again, a lot of us, that are socialized in a way to be rewarded for what we are doing well, and those of us that, you know, that was my personal experience, living in the Imperial Valley, in Southern California in a very agricultural socio economically, you know, I'm gonna say depressed environment where there are not a lot of opportunities. My number one goal was to get the hell out of there. And it was not just the social economic environment, and it's no knock on people who are successful, and my, you know, my peers who grew up to have wonderful lives there.

Dr. Lauren Mason Carris

It was also a product of my personal family life. And the product of, you know, I'll be really transparent here and say that I, my father was incarcerated for a period of time, like, you know, money, success, opportunities, those were all challenges, and, you know, drugs and addiction were really, you know, a part of my environment, not me personally, but just like, it affected my family. And it's taken me a lifetime, to, you know, come to a place where I can get like over that and not let that be my brand. And not let that be my story. Right. But I share that because I sought out those opportunities. Where was I getting funding? Where was I getting accolades? Where was I getting recognition, and that for me was important is when I think about my values, recognition is important. My personal brand, it is important to me.

Dr. Lauren Mason Carris

And if I find myself in an environment, where I'm not getting that recognition, and by the way, it doesn't have to be like hooting hollering, you know, whatever I've learned, you know how to adopt that. But that is important to me, like words of affirmation are important to me. Other people acknowledge my contributions, that's important to me, I need to be seen. So academia was a place where I thrived. I was able to bring, you know, new insights to critical research on identity on a mixed identity. That's where my research was, was on, you know, language, race, and ethnicity. And how do people actively craft their identities? Wink, wink? Right.

Dra. Yvette Martinez-Vu

I've been that's how I like that conversation of identity formation and language.

Dr. Lauren Mason Carris

What it was, yeah. And so I knew it well, in the context of academia. And what drove me to academia was wanting to make a big difference, wanting to have an impact. I was a, a teacher, an English language development teacher in middle school and got no respect, because nobody cared about my migrant farmworker children. And it was they weren't gonna take any respect from me at 21 years old, straight out of college, like, no, who's gonna listen to me? So again, looking for that recognition, right. And this is only after years of reflecting like, what was happening, it was not. And I think it's important, yes, we preach and support and want to remind people to be intentional, but it's okay to actually pause and forgive yourself for not being intentional until this moment. Yeah.

Dr. Lauren Mason Carris

And you know, that a lot of this was me kind of like discovering and figuring out and fumbling. And in grad school, in fact, when it got to a place where I actually took on responsibility for my nephew, and brought him in, you know, to raise him and both of my parents had passed away. Again, there was an economic driver, and a stability driver that deterred me from wanting to further pursue tenure track positions. By the way, I was out on the market, and I was interviewing for and I was, you know, ready to pull up. But going back to my values and interests, I wanted to be stable. I didn't want to move around a lot at the moment. I needed to quiet and create this safety net. And, and I had that hunger and desire, for frankly, more immediate gratification. I wanted to work and get recognized for the work that I was contributing, and bring my research into an applied space where it could have an impact faster. And that was a driver for me to leave academia.

Dra. Yvette Martinez-Vu

You know, I feel like I'm trying to envision grad student listeners right now. And I'm also trying to think about the moment in time that we're in thinking about, you know, what people call the Great Resignation, people are thinking about transitions about change. And I think that a lot of people will resonate with you sharing about wanting more stability about wanting to be able to provide for your family, but want desiring something that maybe possibly would not be a possibility or maybe not right away within academia in terms of like not wanting to move around a lot and not wanting to adjunct, you know, certain things that sometimes become the norm. And so, I still, I feel like I still want to know a little bit more how do you go from from linguistics to working for a tech company, like for folks who are interested in like, well, I'm in the humanities, right, I'm in this, it seems like a field that wouldn't directly apply to tech to user experience. How did you make that leap?

Dr. Lauren Mason Carris

It wasn't, it wasn't overnight. So you know, my, my jump from academia into quote, unquote, you know, industry was actually moving to work for an online learning university. So it was laureate universities, it was global. There were hundreds of 1000s of students, we had staff all across the nation. And it was actually another Latina graduate student who told me that her husband worked for this company, she was like, hey, if you like want to get into it, you have a skill set, going back to brand, skill set, part of Applied Linguistics, and my graduate program was language, language teaching and learning, and curriculum development, right.

Dr. Lauren Mason Carris

So curriculum, writing, curriculum, evaluation, assessment, development, those were all skills that I had acquired in my graduate program, and had been actively working on research. That's not like the fun research around identity that I was doing. But I found really important ways to, to interweave those and talk about, you know, in some of my research, how they impact each other, and an advocate for bringing them together, but being able to apply that in the curriculum development space. And that was just at the beginning. I mean, you should look back at some of the emails I got from my faculty advisors, like, I can't believe you're leaving all of this, you know, all this guilt, like you.

Dra. Yvette Martinez-Vu

I believe, because I've been there.

Dr. Lauren Mason Carris

You could do so much for us, you know, like, you're the Latina scholar that could totally transform all of this, like, blah, blah, blah. And I was like, yeah, and I also like, can't be living on these loans anymore, and not making money. Like, I'm raising a family now. And it didn't happen, you know, in the wave intentionally, maybe that I would have crafted my future life. But this is the reality. And being able to move really quickly in that environment, I went from a curriculum writer to then a manager, and then moved into a director role, because my value is hard work and recognition, I did everything I could to understand the system, and to see what system I am working in, and where I could provide value and how I could mentor team members. And that's where I found a lot of gratification was in those leadership roles. But I learned the business of online learning, I learned the business of curriculum development, I learned the business of that was, you know, back in 2011, 2012. So online learning was still the devil.

Dra. Yvette Martinez-Vu

Oh, this was like, before it was the norm to work remotely, to do things online.

Dr. Lauren Mason Carris

Yeah, so much shade, because it was a for profit company. Oh, this and that. And I was like, You know what, but they have a social justice agenda. Like everyone who goes through these programs are social justice scholars looking to make an impact in their community, you know, so, again, really resonating with these, like marginalized stories about some industry, right, cut to them working for in program design at CSUN. And I was working with the continuing education program.

Dr. Lauren Mason Carris

Then moving into working, I got recruited for Western Governors University, who, that's where I got an opportunity really to get involved in the tech and in tech development and program development and user experience design. How is it that students know what they need to do and it becomes intuitive for them? How can we redesign these experiences? How do we, you know, just a lot of questions around supporting users as students or students as users in technologies, and then getting swept up by tech companies like, hey, you've done it in these big places, help us deliver it in this space. And then edtech companies, and now eventually outside of education, a tech company who's looking to bring learning in, because even software companies and other products are realizing, whoa, our users are also learners, how do we help them learn our tools and learn to be better professionals are better, you know, in their role, through the best strategies and tactics and want.

Dr. Lauren Mason Carris

So it's, it's a, you know, curated, looking at those opportunities, finding ways and where they fit and resonate with my brand, my values, my interests, my skill set, but also importantly, identifying where are there some gaps or opportunities for me to grow. So it was never about the title. It was never about the brand. It is about the brand of the company that I work with, but not exclusively, like, I'm not going because I want to be, you know, Western Governors University person, no, I'm going because I like what they have to offer. And that can help my brand, right, and keeping that sort of people talked about professional distancing, or that emotional kind of boundary, right? Like, no, this is me, this is what I am offering, this is what I'm looking to achieve out of it. This is how they can help me grow. And the second you find that that gap is too wide, then looking for where you can rebrand yourself, where you can find brand alignment with a different opportunity. And it's the nature of how the world of work has changed so much, so much.

Dra. Yvette Martinez-Vu

I do think you know that we're there now. It's also the future. But wer're there now in many ways. You mentioned so many, I feel like terms that may be new to some of the students. But that just remind me of the many ways that academic skill sets can be translated into industry and other career options. You mentioned, ed tech, you mentioned. So et tech companies, you mentioned user experience. I'm thinking also you mentioned this, but like, project management is a big one that's common. You mentioned curriculum design, like project management, like you've managed your entire dissertation and committee, you've taught and you're thinking of the things that grad students typically do, that in and of itself is a kind of project management. Those are all options. It's just about knowing what they are and how your skills translate in that way.

Dra. Yvette Martinez-Vu

And then like you said, you know, it's really, really important to try to align yourself and try to align your personal branding with whatever it is that you pursue, but not necessarily. I mean, I personally wouldn't necessarily want to enmeshed myself and my identity with the, you know, the company that I work with, because that's kind of what happens with academics.

Dr. Lauren Mason Carris

Yeah, and I'm really keeping that boundary of who am I and how do I fit and serve? And who are they and how do they fit and serve me and it's a very different way of thinking because I don't I won't speak for your listeners are for you even but I'll say for myself there's an emotional wrestling with, is that too capitalistic? Is that too opportunistic? Am I like falling into the trap of all of these other people that I don't want to be like, you know, by, you know, setting up those boundaries, like those of us that have been in service roles, whether it's in our families or in our communities, our are almost hardwired, like we've rewired our dopamine hits and our serotonin to celebrate, then when we are getting, you know, that when we are serving, and it is this fear, like we've got to like, that's where the quote unquote work comes in of this constant evaluation and constant, you know, reflection and constant when people say rebranding, it doesn't have to be an overhaul. Right. It doesn't have to be like, okay, now I'm no longer gonna wear purple because that's not part of my brand.

Dr. Lauren Mason Carris

In a very superficial level, you know, when you think of product or marketing or website rebranding, sometimes it's the color and that takes a lot of work, but I'm trying to apply that like to us. It can be at these different levels and it can be incremental. In fact, it should be a constant, you know, evaluation. And so I think in grad school, we're often taught to think about our Curriculum Vita. Right. And, and, and for newer academics, I would say, even for newer professionals, at least for me, it's like, how many things can I pull into this? And this long list? Yeah. How many skills? Can I say that I fit with? Like you mentioned, project management, and all these things that do apply. But let me just put all of them here. And you end up like washing out the true brand value, like, okay, but that's great that you do all of these things. But who are you? How do you fit here? Who do you want to be?

Dr. Lauren Mason Carris

And, you know, really years of, and I think a lot of people can resonate with the great resignation, and being on the job market, whether it's academic or not trying to fit with some description that's out there, and you compromise so much of what you truly offer. Right? And it's, it's an art to refine over time and to figure out like, Okay, how do I? How do I show that I fit that I'm a good fit? How do I present myself so that I am attractive to this job, this opportunity, this whatever the world, whatever, right, but without compromising the values that I have, without compromising my real interest? Like, yeah, I'll do that for a little side project. But I don't want to do that forever. Well, then take note and remove that from your personal brand. Remove that from your CV, remove that, from your social media bio, like, yeah, we can all do a lot of things. But who are you? And who do you want to be?

Dra. Yvette Martinez-Vu

It's interesting, because we're not taught to remove, or I wasn't taught to remove things from my CV. In my experience in grad school, I also wasn't taught to say no to things. I wasn't taught to be intentional about the things I said yes and no to. And I was taught to just be grateful for anything that I was offered.

Dr. Lauren Mason Carris

I think, a common I think it's the way a lot of us have been socialized to be. And it's reinforced so many times by the people that love us, it's no, you know, it's no shade to them, like, my mom over and over would be just so excited. And like, yes, we'll go and do it. And, you know, you get these, and you want to honor them, and you want to honor others, and, you know, and take those opportunities, but who's going to advocate for your sanity. And for your you know, you are the only one that can identify where you are compromising your true value.

Dra. Yvette Martinez-Vu

I was wondering if you could expand a little bit more on so we said we're gonna talk about personal brand design, but also the business of personal development. So you've mentioned the word business a couple of times. And, you know, when I would think about business before, before becoming a solopreneur, I thought of it as you know, this is something that's just over there for the folks that get their MBAs and for the folks that are, you know, going into industry are the folks that want to make a lot of money, I want to make a lot of money. I just had this association of business as bad, making money as bad, when in reality, it's what you do with it that could be good or bad, depending on how you interpret it. So I would love to hear more about kind of your take on business, business of personal development, and why kind of it's useful for folks to think about that.

Dr. Lauren Mason Carris

Yeah. I'll start by explaining that one of the first engagements like the first conscious engagements I had with quote unquote, business was when I was doing some adjunct teaching at the Anderson School of Business. I was I was teaching classes to support International MBA students, fully employed International MBA students, improve their communication skills, and improve their spoken English in order to evolve in their professional development. And there's this giant light bulb that went off like I'm over here struggling, and these people are like, benefiting from my value. Right now, obviously, they were paying for me so I'm not like mad about it. But I'm like, what, there's a whole business to this.

Dr. Lauren Mason Carris

And again, from Humanities and Social Studies, not being socialized and also as a first generation student, not being socialized ever to think of the economic value or the business model that's being presented. So that was my first orientation. And it again took years because it was new to me to really learn about it. Cut to my experience working at Western Governors University and also for Find Your Grind as a startup, both of those experiences specifically required me to explore social emotional learning, and the curriculum of social emotional learning. It just so happens that there is a whole industry of self help, that overlaps with social emotional learning.

Dr. Lauren Mason Carris

And it can get very fuzzy, there's the there's, you know, the research and the science and the curriculum behind it. And then there's this whole like, you know, talk about venn diagrams, the other circle that starts to overlap, which is the popular field of self help, right? Not formally trained gurus, and guides, and, you know, teachers and facilitators, and you see a lot of it emerge in the wellness industry as well. Right? Well, good, better, indifferent, that's topic for another day, they have mastered the business of professional development and self help. I guarantee any one of your listeners, and you and I, both on our social media feeds will find a number of individuals that have monetized the value of their insights to help others evolve. And that alone is a it's not a bad thing, right? I mean, it's, it's actually, in this time of economic transformation, where we're all shifting to understand new economies and play in the.

Dra. Yvette Martinez-Vu

I was gonna, say, that's a little of what I'm doing. And I'm seeing a lot of my own, like women of color mother friends kind of going along that that route. Like I used to think about the, sorry, I'm going a little bit on a tangent, oh, no, we're gonna cutting it close on time. Yes, but like the educational pipeline, the Latinx educational pipeline, the black educational type pipeline, and I used to think because I've done research on mothers, scholars in the, you know, in academia, mothers of color in academia. And I used to think, oh, my goodness, like, it's terrible that as and it is, it is terrible, that as you move up kind of the ladder, you see fewer and fewer and more people are leaving, and I used to think, well, you know, they, we should try to keep them keep them. But then and then I thought about how many of them actively decided to leave are more pushed out to pursue other options. So you know, just, just from my own experiences, and also doing a little bit of reading on on just kind of the rising numbers of women of color black women entrepreneurs who are doing their own thing, I feel like, yeah, a lot of us have found a way to, to make a living out of what we know, to support others without necessarily having to rely on other institutions to, you know, to put a value on our labor.

Dr. Lauren Mason Carris

Or to dictate your limits, right. And so it is the rise of the knowledge economy, and, you know, women of color, and, you know, other intersectional identities, claiming space in that economy. And, you know, the research that I've done around Gen Z. And the research that I've done in the world of work, what you described in academia is a microcosm of society, because you see, patterns across industries, there's either a lack of, or they are leaving, so the question of why are they being pushed out? Why are they not valued for, you know, for that knowledge economy and a really critical role they play in being a model in younger people being able to see themselves in that future state and being attracted to it and you know, therefore attracting, you know, the new generations of, you know, whatever pipeline that is, and so, these are, these are patterns that are across industries, across sectors, and you know, Gen Z and I think late Millennials masters tapping into free access for that.

Dr. Lauren Mason Carris

So, why do you think Tik Tok, YouTube, you know, all of these knowledge spaces have felt are getting rewarded, right, so may not have been an intentional monetization of it, but they are getting rewarded because of so many views to then be be paid for. Right? It's it's these interesting kind of cycles of where the attention is in the attention economy, right? So anyway, we could, we could talk a ton about these, like shifting economies. But I think what what you were talking about noticing people leaving is my point was it's not unique to academia. And I think it comes. Because when we look critically at our personal brand, and recognize whether it resonates or does not resonate with the environment, or the context or situation we're in, if we are intentional about what we want to create, then the choice is yours. But the choice is obvious to like, you got to move on.

Dra. Yvette Martinez-Vu

Right, and that, that's so hard. But I also think, I'm glad that we're having this conversation, because it's gonna allow individuals to also be more mindful about what they're consuming, and how they're consuming it and in what spaces and platforms are doing so. And then to think about that for themselves, too, if they choose to create their own, you know, their own content, or, or be active in these types of platforms. I want to get close to kind of wrapping on, I know, we only have a couple more minutes, I want to kind of honor your time, but I wanted to ask you if there are any other words of advice that you want to share, you know, for first gen students of color, any closing words, anything that you wish you would have known had you been an undergrad or in grad school about this topic of personal brand, brand design.

Dr. Lauren Mason Carris

I think I'm the so I'll start with what I wish I would have known. And I wish that I would have been supported to explore more. Um, I, you know, in retrospect, felt like, I had to have a goal, even if I didn't love it and didn't see myself there, I had to, like, make something up. Right and and commit to it. And I think there was not enough tolerance, then I really support now, exploring. It's something that I try to do with my kids, like, you don't have to have it all figured out. You don't have to have it figured out. Once you're like working, like it's not an end.

Dr. Lauren Mason Carris

So two things to that explore more, and really be forgiving of yourself to constantly evolve. I feel like, you know, all the research around identity formation is that it's an evolution. I was writing about it, I was researching it. Same thing, even in teaching in education, I was right. I was doing it. But I was not applying that to myself in the true sense. Yes. And idea. Like I'll continue to evolve and grow and whatever, but like, evolve into what and what if we explore some of that there's just not available to me. And so I hope that your listeners and and your, you know, community and you going forward can support each other to explore more, and really be patient about the evolution.

Dra. Yvette Martinez-Vu

Okay, one very last last question. I promise you this is the last one is if folks resonated with you and want to connect with you in some way, shape, or form, how can they reach you or connect with you?

Dr. Lauren Mason Carris

Yeah, I think LinkedIn is the most easily accessible. It's also the best way to see the evolution of my personal brand, you can look at some of the bookmarked posts that I have most recently that capture my journey. You know, other social media feeds, Instagram is relatively private. Facebook, I'm rarely ever on and Twitter. I'm more of a consumer and a reshare, then, but you can still find me if you Google my name, and you know, look it up there, but but LinkedIn is where I'm most active.

Dra. Yvette Martinez-Vu

Great. All right, I'll make sure to share the LinkedIn information then. Alright, well, thank you so much, Lauren, for coming on. I learned a thing or two. I was like, okay, I'm gonna read this and take some notes because this is really, really good. I'm so excited to release it. And to have had the privilege to share kind of space with you today. So thank you so much for your time.

Dr. Lauren Mason Carris

It's my honor. Thank you.